TALL- LONG CASE / GRANDFATHER CLOCK: CASE STYLES: PRE 1860: A study.

[laprade]

Jeremy, another gem, bravo, and you saved me the trouble of having to sketch the hood door lock.

Firstly; things to note from Jeremy's post.

The trunk door hinges are strap hinges that look old and hand made. But an important point is the style of hinge post. This style is generally known as “acorn”. In some cases the acorn shape is very obvious and I have borrowed Jeremy's and Oldcat's hinges to show this. (the only other picture on the thread of an acorn is one I took, but is out of focus: Ashford, Kent clock)
The next point is about the trunk door escutcheon. Compare Jeremy's with the Ashford clock, which I said was a repro.
Note the nails to fix the hood lock bolt, and screws to fix the hasp.
The next point is the orientation if the base panel: it is horizontal. This is not unusual and doesn't mean it is a repair. Many country clocks had horizontal and not vertical base front panels.

While on the subject of wood. I like the use of oak cross banding on oak: it introduces a sort of subtlety to the design.

What surprizes me is the lack of obvious medullary rays which come with quarter sawn oak. I'm wondering if there might be some elm in the case, could be way off course!

The matt finish on the dial, I was told is usually from the sand casting, and not polished out.

The town of Highworth is in Wiltshire, I couldn't find another, and that would explain the use of “a high London style”. Wiltshire is the first of the “West Country” counties from London. One could guess that the customer had ordered a “London style” from a rural cabinet maker. Mahogany was expensive, but the cabinet maker went to extra trouble to imitate a prevailing London style, hence the top upper hood and the cross-banding. Remove the upper hood, and you have the Kent and Essex clocks shown earlier.

Jeremy's point about the finials is a good one. Not all clocks were festooned with knobs and spikes, and if the truth be known, a lot of existing finials are additions. Bill Marney, of Garner and Marney, told me that they made and sold over a thousand finials a year, not to mention dials.

Talking of which; the numerals on large dials are cut with a hammer and chisel. The chapter ring is set into a bed of pitch, and then chiselled.

[Sooth]

Laprade (or anyone else), I wonder if you might have any photos of rising hood latches/catches. Especially the type used on the backboard to temporarily support the hood while winding the clock. I'd also really like to see a spoon latch. I have heard about both these types of catches many times, and even seen some crude drawings, but I have yet to see a photo of either in any books or web pages I've seen to date. At most, I've glimpsed a partial shot of the backboard latch.

[Jeremy Woodoff]

About the dial matting, I've seen descriptions of punch tools and rolling tools used to create the matting. The next clock I'm going to show has clear evidence that a tool of this type was used.

[laprade]

Jeremy, I agree, there are tools for doing some of the matting. Such tools would leave traces of the punch points, much the same way, oddly enough, as when you use a "cloning tool" on a picture management program. Also, from experience, (I made ten complete brass faces in 77, under the supervision of a master engraver), when punching, it effects the shape of the brass plate, and you have to plannish it to compensate. The centre section starts to bow into a concave. The punch work has to be done before you place the pillars, (studs).

The sand method leaves no repetitions. Sometimes you can see “sand marks” on the edges of the cut-outs behind the chapter.

Sooth, you have me there. All the long cases (Eire & UK) I have seen, were always wound by opening the hood door, like a normal door. The hoods all “slide” forward to be removed, and are held steady by two rails either side of the top of the trunk. Just below the projections for placement of the seat board. I think, if what you describe, was known to the book people, it would be shown somewhere. The problem with a lot of clock books, is that some details aren't shown, either because the writer didn't bother or never noticed. Unless a clock can be taken a part and photographed, one never sees these things. A lot of book pictures that I have seen are mostly of “façades” and are taken in situations, where dismantling was not an option, as is the case of some of the pictures I have posted, because I couldn't get into the cases. The one recent clock that I was able to dismantle, was the Ashford one, because I was repairing it. It had a hood stop, the crude oak swivel, which only stopped the hood from coming off: it isn't a door lock.

Not that I mention it, I should elaborate for the readers. The bolt and hasp, nicely shown by Jeremy, is for locking the top door. The clock can't be advanced or retarded, or wound, if the lock is closed, and the trunk door locked, with the key in the master's pocket. I always assumed that such door locks, were to stop the servants from fiddling the time! The Ashford clock could still be opened. (picture) In fact, I didn't know it was there, until I tried to move the hood. And even after that, it dropped into the space between the case frame and the front moulding!

I also show a picture of a hood slide-guide.

[makeshift]

Messrs. Laprade and Woodof, and other readers of course. I and my nephew helper, found this clock when googling for "Irish" clocks.

It has almost the same style as the nice Highworth clock. The information said that it is from Ballymena. We are sorry that we can't supply any more details. (The pine clock, we posted earlier is also said to be from Ballymena.)

From the picture below, it can be seen that the base has a raised panel, as opposed to the "horizontal" panel on the Highworth clock.

To add further to Mr. Laprade's thoughts on origins of style, I would suggest that the instructions to the maker of such a case, was probably by someone who "was in the know" and maybe even had a London town house. In the 18th and early 19th centuries, a place like Ballymena, wouldn't have been in the height of fashion. Politics also would have had an influence. The Anglo Irish Ascendency who had Dublin as their centre, were quite a different lot, to those from the north, who had Belfast as a centre. The Northerners would have a more direct link with London, as they were very suspicious of those from the South, who had long links with Ireland: some from Norman times.
Another idea, is that this Ballymena clock case was imported from England.

[Sooth]

No, the type of hardware I'm interested in seeing is the type used on much earlier clocks. They are found on early rising hood clocks (such as marquetry longcases). These clocks are usually shorter, making it possible to raise the hood w/o hitting the ceiling.

From what I have read, many of these early clocks did not have a door on the hood. Some were later sawn/modified to have a door, but most did not. Instead, you had to unlock and open the trunk door (to release the spoon latch holding down the hood), then raise the hood until the latch on the backboard clicked into place and supported it. I believe that the hood only raised up to about 1/3 to 1/4 from the top of the dial, but I'm not 100% certain of this.

I have (somewhere...) a partial photo of the rear latch, and it looks like a spring loaded L shaped hook. I wish I could find the photo, but I have no idea where I had seen it.

Derek Roberts gives this brief description on his page on longcase clock care:
"The hood may now be slid forward and removed. The only exception is on a few very early clocks made prior to circa 1690 which still have lift-up hoods and are held by a catch in their raised position for winding. Although they are usually locked down by a spoon latch, this is automatically released when the trunk door is opened."

This site shows a crude drawing:
http://www.bafra.org.uk/html_pages/articles_longclocks.html

[laprade]

I see what you mean, Sooth, and confess that my mind is a blank. Some museum must have one and some photos. The chances of someone on the board having such a thing, will be remote. Chris Radano has some early things, as he posted one a while back, he might have seen one, or knows where one might be.

The link didn't sit right in your post, I had to select / copy / paste, to get it to work. (Maybe a Mod could adjust it, Harold adjusted one of mine a while back)

Interesting article. Well found, Sooth, bravo. I know the time it takes to rummage around for this sort of thing.

[Sooth]

You may be interested to know that I've found the photo(s) that I was thinking about. They are from a book on English Domestic Clocks, but the images show the overall clock with the hood lifted (2 photos of this), and you can barely make out the latch. I will try to photograph these (as I have no scanner), and upload them.

Note: Since when can we not go back and edit our posts/comments? I used to be able to post links as-is, and they would get auto-formatted to work, but now I see that there is an "insert link" button above that you need to use.

[swankyman]

Not sure what you all are looking for but here are a photo of the hinges on my Long case. Mark


http://mb.nawcc.org/showthread.php?t=54355

[Sooth]

Nice photos mark, but what I'm on about is the hardware that is found on early longcase clocks with a rising hood. These clocks use rails (dovetails) on the backboard, where the hood slides upwards, then locks in place near the top for winding and adjustment. The hood has no hinges, since there is no door.